NG Models 747-8

[pons399]

That’s really interesting, thanks for that insight I find this whole process fascinating and it involves highly skilled precision work, great to talk with someone with some direct experience in this area.

That is a really good question you raise - and one which I ask myself, because the issue of mould accuracy affects all scale models in various hobbies, and discussions such as this are taking place right now in 00/HO railway modelling. Tools such as 3D laser scanning have advanced and aided accuracy in CAD/CAM, with access to the prototype - site visits are conducted to carry out surveys to support the work. However this is with preserved railway organisations within the UK, and info is then sent to the factory in China from UK-based companies. It must simply be down to access to enough raw information? I know NG were given actual blueprint data for the L-1011 - this resulted in a highly accurate tooling. Perhaps the same level of info has not been available in the instance of the 747?

I think access to blueprints and CAD files for the 747 would be quite restricted, as they're Boeing's IP and the 747 will still be flying for decades to come. The L-1011 line's been inactive for ages, so the laws around its schematics are likely more lenient.

The "forehead" is almost a non-issue as long as they get the cockpit windows right, but I don't think it'll take a whole lot of work anyway? Just a slight modification on the existing CAD file, followed by CNC-ing a new mould for the fuselage section should do the job. First release is allegedly in May, so would 2 months be enough?

 

[pons399]

Also, -8F review's up.

 

[B767Avia]

Sounds like a good explanation as their TriStar (and maybe Panda's 134) are among the very few "flawless" looking castings.

And they were definitely not given one for the 747. They made a mistake on the flap markings under the wing, which is pretty far off if you ask me, since the spoilers are not at all visible through the bottom and the sample shows it.

 

[Barison82]

I think access to blueprints and CAD files for the 747 would be quite restricted, as they're Boeing's IP and the 747 will still be flying for decades to come. The L-1011 line's been inactive for ages, so the laws around its schematics are likely more lenient.

The "forehead" is almost a non-issue as long as they get the cockpit windows right, but I don't think it'll take a whole lot of work anyway? Just a slight modification on the existing CAD file, followed by CNC-ing a new mould for the fuselage section should do the job. First release is allegedly in May, so would 2 months be enough?

Absolutely, IP would certainly come into it - but I thought NG carried an official license from Boeing? It’s printed on the box and it looks ‘legit’? You’d think it would allow the use of some accurate line drawings at least.

Re-doing the CAD/CAM process for machining a new fuselage tooling would be extremely expensive at this late stage; it’s possible but somehow I find it extremely unlikely that this would happen after samples have been shown. It would mean an extension of what should have taken place in the initial R&D stages; I don’t think this process could take place in time as I’d imagine the production schedule would be imminent, for the casting run. A very tight window before first release and distribution.

 

[1400_Aircraft_Models]

Also, -8F review's up.

Was it an unrealistic hope of mine when I hoped that the door support beams that sit above and below the side cargo door to be moulded in like on the JC interactive series?

 

[Barison82]

I spent a few years working (training) in the "mould business", though our moulds were used for precission casts of tech ceramics. Naturally die sinking EDM was the way to go and electrodes were done using precission milling in a CAM environment. This was last century!
But that raises my question: HOW can shapes of diecast models be off? Aren't they based on CAD (so that shapes can be triple checked via render or 3D-printing before producing the mould) but really old old school "hand carved"?
I thought NG is a bit more "Next Generation" here.

Depending on the mould you could weld on material and then work it to shape. Not sure in how far this is doable in this case.

That bit about welding additional material - it would be tough in this scale for minute +/- operations; I’d imagine you’d almost have to refill the area and then re-machine it. The weld/bond would have to be fused amazingly well to withstand the heat and pressure of the liquid metal injection process too I would have thought. In any case, these are expensive and complex alterations to carry out and for 1:400 especially, it’s crucial that the R&D is done throughly beforehand. It’s that magic word ‘consistency’ which is so hard to achieve! I do fear that NG have expanded so much, so quickly that it has affected this area somewhat.

 

[pons399]

And they were definitely not given one for the 747. They made a mistake on the flap markings under the wing, which is pretty far off if you ask me, since the spoilers are not at all visible through the bottom and the sample shows it.

Thanks for pointing this out, would it be fine with you if I email the pic to NG?

 

[B767Avia]

Thanks for pointing this out, would it be fine with you if I email the pic to NG?

By all means please! I have emailed them about this but more the merrier, and faster the better.

 

[Barison82]

I hope you guys get a result. Your efforts are appreciated

 

[B767Avia]

Last time, for the 777, NG was kind enough to send me a follow-up diagram of their adjusted designs, and they posted a new set of wings on their socials shortly after. Fingers crossed we'll get a similar response for this too. The 747 deserves it.

 

[Barison82]

Last time, NG was kind enough to send me a follow-up diagram of their adjusted designs, and they posted a new set of wings on their socials shortly after. Fingers crossed we'll get a similar response for this too. The 747 deserves it.

Well that was a pretty good bit of feedback from them! Fingers crossed, it certainly does!

 

[pons399]

Last time, for the 777, NG was kind enough to send me a follow-up diagram of their adjusted designs, and they posted a new set of wings on their socials shortly after. Fingers crossed we'll get a similar response for this too. The 747 deserves it.

That's amazing, I'll definitely shoot them an email tonight. It's nice to see so many collectors actively giving feedback, that's often the best way to compel a company to act.

 

[OscarBravo992]

By all means please! I have emailed them about this but more the merrier, and faster the better.

If it’s ok with you, I will too. I’ve already been having a discussion with them surrounding the existing issues, so this would be a natural topic to bring up.

 

[pons399]

If it’s ok with you, I will too. I’ve already been having a discussion with them surrounding the existing issues, so this would be a natural topic to bring up.

Just curious, how receptive have they been?

 

[B767Avia]

Just curious, how receptive have they been?

I did receive a reply the other day, no follow up diagrams or anything like last time though. I'm planning to ask for one soon, and until then, one can only hope they'll get to it.

 

[OscarBravo992]

Just curious, how receptive have they been?

Very! I've had quite a nice conversation with them and they have said that they will try and take some of the changes I recommended on board.

 

[pons399]

I did receive a reply the other day, no follow up diagrams or anything like last time though. I'm planning to ask for one soon, and until then, one can only hope they'll get to it.

How long did it take for them to send you the 777 diagrams? I reckon it would take at least a week to complete.

Very! I've had quite a nice conversation with them and they have said that they will try and take some of the changes I recommended on board.

That's excellent news! I don't expect the forehead to be tweaked, but the windows, fan blades and flaps are must-fixes. Wouldn't expect any less from NG.

 

[B767Avia]

How long did it take for them to send you the 777 diagrams? I reckon it would take at least a week to complete.

Surprisingly it only took them a day. Their first reply already contained the diagram.

I personally don't quite understand all the drama with the forehead and cockpit (this goes for the SP as well), but like you said the fanblades, flaps, and the passenger windows are a must.

 

[pons399]

Surprisingly it only took them a day. Their first reply already contained the diagram.

I personally don't quite understand all the drama with the forehead and cockpit (this goes for the SP as well), but like you said the fanblades, flaps, and the passenger windows are a must.

Forehead's almost a non-issue if the cockpit windows are corrected... But if they're the same as on the SP, I'm not sure if they're wrong at all. Might just be the pictures. Doesn't hurt for NG to double check though.

Do post an update if/when NG sends you an updated diagram!

 

[pons399]

Last time, for the 777, NG was kind enough to send me a follow-up diagram of their adjusted designs, and they posted a new set of wings on their socials shortly after. Fingers crossed we'll get a similar response for this too. The 747 deserves it.

Just curious, but what was the issue with the 777's wings?